Same Sex Marriage Blog

Virginians will vote this November on an amendment to the state constitution that will explicity define marriage as between a man and a woman. U.Va marriage expert Brad Wilcox joins Coy Barefoot on the June 22 edition of WINA’s Charlottesville–Right Now to discuss the challenges that face the institution.

Well, from what I know, a corperation is considered a living entity, right? So isnt it the same as marriage when 2 corperations merge? And if it about sex, what sex is a corperation? This is why same sex mariage should be leagal, or then it should be made illegal for corperations to merge, because corperations are the same sex. If companies can pool thier resorces in this way, then the citizen can also merger with another and pool thier resorces. Marriage is a religion based idea, but in the 21st century, marriage should be seen as a bussiness deal, that way the government has the right to make the decisions on mergers in the first place. Like they threw the monpoly laws to the wind, does that mean we can have more than 1 wife or husband?

Yes…marriage is a religious thing. Marriage is not like a business none what so ever. It is not like a corporation either. I do not care how you look at it. Marriage is very sacred. GOD did not make Adam and Steve or Eve and Ashley. I respect gay men but I do not like the idea of gay marriages. It is not right and it should not be permittable.

I think that gay marriage should be allowed. i see no difference in the marriage of a straight couple and a gay couple, other than the fact that they are of the same sex. They are still devoted to each other and love each other. Why shouldn’t they be allowed to express their love with marriage like every other staight couple is allowed to do? As our world is constantly changing, so are our ideas. We should be able to be more accepting and understanding with our viewpoints.

Marriage in church and state: within a religious practice, marriage is a ritual which brings about a definitive change in the condition of the soul. When marriage is a sacrament, it participates in a transcendental continuum which is infinite and eternal. Thus religious marriages participate in mythic powers which are not answerable to science, humanistic reason, civil law, tradition, or to mundane experience.

As Marianne Moore has written:
I’m sure of this:
Nothing mundane is divine;
Nothing divine is mundane.

A ritualistic wedding, under the care of God, can overlap and supplement a civil wedding within a secular state. However, a civil wedding does not participate in an infinite and eternal transcendental continuum. A religious marriage is answerable to an infinite and eternal God, yet a religious marriage is also answerable to secular law, which is finite and temporal. Hence a secular state need not enforce religious laws revealed from the transcendental God. Polygamy obeys a transcendental revelation which is taken as divine law, rather than civil law. Federal constitutional grounds for the unlawfulness of polygamy are not obvious, and indeed, local civil laws are often allowed to go unenforced. Religious and civil marriages can be allowed to overlap, but in only one direction, with the religious overlapping the secular, while the secular does not include the religious. That is, while the religious acknowledges the civil, the civil need not submit to the religious. In the United States, a religious marriage must render unto Caesar (Julius Caesar was legendary as every woman’s husband and every man’s wife, but under neither divine or mundane law, without benefit of marriage). In religious logic, ideas and images overlap each other: God is Love, God is Light, God is Truth, Beauty and Goodness. In religious terms, both the soul of a male and the soul of a female can marry God, or one of the Persons of God, with the soul as a Bride of the Christ. A wedding and marriage are meanings, with the meaning of a religious wedding quite different from the meaning of a civil wedding. Religious concepts easily transcend and outwit the technical logic of civil marriage, the concepts overflowing with meanings, while the concepts of civil marriage contract into intelligible rules. A civil marriage, which has little metaphorical value, is less a mystical union than a contractual obligation (different yet still religious relations between marriage and contract appear in Islam, where marriage is a contractual union). Civil law, in contrast with religious law, is not free to overlap concepts: a civic good may be in conflict with a civic beauty, and civil justice, unlike divine justice, may not claim to represent absolute justice. In One Nation Under God, the Nation is specifiable, the God is not. A state-wedding is a construction which is specifiable throughout, while in contrast a ritual wedding is an unspecifiable mystery. A civil wedding takes the mystery out of marriage, while religious marriage in the Judeo-Christian traditions is answerable to God and to God’s laws, which are not easily interpreted uniformly, and which are difficult to appeal from, since God is Justice. Civil law, thinking technically, must differentiate concepts, both describing and prescribing minute distinctions a judge may rule on. Such a ruling is always itself yet to be ruled on if problems like injustice arise. Religious marriage, historically, has never been fair to women, while civil marriage has sometimes been unfair, as when marriage to a foreign national could cost a woman her citizenship.
In the United States, under the Constitution as it was first constructed, and now as it survives continuous reconstructions, the Constitution does not protect religious marriage; and is forbidden to do so under the separation of a secular government from religious values, powers and rituals. Legal marriage is left to the states, which govern only secular civil actions. Thus a religious marriage has no necessary implications for civil marriage, and civil marriage has no necessary implications for religious marriage. The Constitution of the United States, which doesn’t mention marriage, cannot require a marriage which participates in religious values, functions, structures and meanings. Nor can the state forbid a specific marriage because a religion forbids such a marriage. Mundane civil marriage, with laws which are themselves on trial for their constitutionality, is always to be separated from a divine marriage which is an act of faith in transcendental mysteries. A civil marriage is not mysterious; its terms should be beyond the reach of transcendental religions. Even the relation of god-child to god-parent is a mysterious relation such that a god-child in Catholicism has not been allowed to marry a god-parent, although a god-parent might marry a god-child outside the Church. In an analogy, a civil adoption does not entail a baptism or a christening, it is a matter of civil law which a judge interprets case-by-case, and is open to in effect a retrial.
The state has no grounds to admit impediments to the marriage of true minds, as long as a few conditions of age and of health are met. Yet some marriages need not submit either to state or church, as with the marriage between Quequeeg and Ishmael in Moby Dick: “He seemed to take to me quite as naturally and unbiddenly as I to him; and when our smoke was over, he pressed his forehead against mine, clasped me round the waist, and said that henceforth we were married.” Fortunately such an inspirited marriage does not need the blessing of a state or the protection of a church, although both the civil state and religions should have an interest in settled emotional and sexual relations among its citizens.

By 2006, religions have relativized marriage, so that a couple can be married in two contrary religions with their different modes of thought. In a religious wedding, a bride and groom must negate some parts of themselves in order to channel God’s love through them, while a civil marriage commits the mind of the citizen more than the soul of a child of God. The methods of thought in religious marriage, that wedding of souls, differ from the methods of thought in a secular wedding, that bond between of citizens. Because “Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion,” under the separation of religious law from secular law, governments in the United States are forbidden to make laws respecting an establishment of religious marriage.

Many peoples arguments is that marriage is a religious thing, god only intended it to be male and female, husband and wife, and that’s just the way things should be. On the other hand why should love be bias and choose sides. If a woman happens to love another woman that’s her choice, you can’t choose who you love, or why you love them. It should be no ones choice but your own on who you can married, regardless of what there sex may be, yes in gods eyes it may be wrong but shouldn’t it be about the internal happiness of every human being that matters, shouldn’t that be the ultimate goal in the world, trying to make people happy, and let them life a happy life without the whispers, and constant judging. I think gays should be able to wake up in the morning be happy with there spouse and live just like everyone else. Think about how you would feel with glaring eyes, and little laughs, wouldn’t YOU just want to be happy.

HERE THIS: gay marriage is here to stay, “as goes Massachusetts, so goes the nation,” and soon gay marriage will be coming to a state near you!

In the three years since the implementation of same-sex marriage in Massachusetts, opponents of equality for same-sex couples have ranted and raved that same-sex marriage weakens the foundation of our society and destroys traditional marriage.

Yet, in those three years, “not one” iota of proof – real factual evidence that could be presented in a court of law – has ever been offered to show that these predictions have come true. Massachusetts continues to rank “FIRST” amongst all states for the greatest longevity of marriage and “LOWEST” divorce rates in the nation, you want proof? “look that up”

GOD IS ABOUT LOVE – NOT HATE!!

it is so easy to consider homosexuality evil without knowing any gay people or without being gay yourself. Shouldn’t people be calibrating this legislation for it increases the quality of life for many people

There will NEVER be same sex marriage. The simple reason is this: Marriage is described as “Holy matrimony” done in the “eyes of GOD”. Would GOD watch what he called an “abomination” and actually condone it? Don’t mis-understand my message here. GOD loves all of his children but, does promise us that we will die in our sins.

It seems to me that when the government is afraid of taking a position on certain issues, using the majority to boicot rights of minorities that the majority already has is not only irresponsible but imprudent as the message is certainly very negative. If the government had allowed the majority to vote on issues like the right to vote for african americans and women, they would have never become voters. The role of the goverment is to protect and enable the same rights for all its citizens, not to allow some be against a few others. Also, the arguments of those opposing marriage rights between 2 people of the same gender have been invalidated by other fact: 1. Separation between church (religion) and State. 2. Marriage does not require a reproductive purpose clause. 3. Religious only ceremonies are not acceptable as legal marriages (therefore, no religious argument should be used). 4. The criminal system is the actual hand of “God” (we punish crimes in several ways, including the death penalty – we don’t leave it to God; in which case, btw, those sticking to the word of God should look into “thou shall not kill” and may be put it on the ballot and actually vote following your religious ideals with as much passion as you do against marriages between people of the same gender).

The man is not without the woman neither the woman without the man in the Lord.

Homosexuality is not natural. Gender is part of our identity. Children need a man and a woman to raise them and teach them how to be good parents. That is the correct model and is consistent with nature, logic, and spirit.

Hi everyone,

Yesterday, a business friend of mine, Perry, stopped by my office to talk and catch up on things. Of course, our subject of choice was the “struggling economy”. You can just imagine how that conversation went. Out of nowhere, I asked him if I had ever told him about writing a letter to Oprah. We both laughed and he said “You are kidding me, you are crazy, I never know what to expect from you. Can I read it?” I gave him a copy and off he went.

A little while later, he came back to my office and closed the door. Teary eyed he thanked me for letting him read it and wanted to know if Oprah had called me. “No” I said, “I don’t even know if she has read it.” “If she has read it” he said, “she would have called. Phil, this letter just might be your GREAT thing.”

I did not sleep last night. I wrote this letter to Oprah almost 5 years ago. Only a few people have ever read it. I’m not sure why I let Perry read it.

This story is about having a passion for an answer, but not really knowing what the question is. It’s about struggling through a process that you know nothing about and most of all about acceptance of oneself.

This story is about my faith in God, but I believe everyone is entitled to their own personal and private religious belief. In no way, do I want to impose my personal belief on anyone. It is part of my story.

Two months after I wrote this letter, the mother of our daughter, Emily contacted us about adopting her. This was just 2 weeks after our webpage was placed on the internet. Three weeks after Emily was born, the mother of our son, Parker contacted us and he was born 5 months to the day after. Now you know why I have not read this letter until recently.

Please enjoy and feel free to pass it to anyone that you think can get inspiration from it.

Best wishes,

Phil

alettertooprah(2003).blogspot.com

Marriage was, in the beginning to join two separate people together for the sake of family. Not all families have children. It’s
simple, marriage is believed to be a religious right which is available for all “opposite-sex” couples. However if marriage if for all opposite-sex religious couples then why is it perfectly fine for an atheist couple to get married? The only reason for someone to be against marriage is their religious beliefs, but nothing is said
about an atheist couple getting married. Marriage is no longer religious, it’s financial. A marriage is an agreement of two people to join everything financially and one to take the name of the other (which is optional) for the sake of a family background. If marriage is legal then anyone of legal age should be able to get married regardless of sexuality.

P.S. Holy Matrimony? How about, “In matrimony” or “dearly beloved, we’re gathered here today to celebrate the joining of two lovers/people/souls/men/women/families in matrimony/marriage.”
And on the subject of a same-sex couples having children. sure it maybe difficult but same-sex couples don’t raise same-sex children. They raise children and it’s the child’s choice to find sexuality.

The best way I have seen it put is;
“if you don’t like gay marriage…..
don’t have one!”

Two men or two women can never make a baby together. Children also need a mother and father to be raised in an optimal way. Sociology, psychology and common sense tell us that children should not be deprived of their need for both a father and a mother by a well-meaning law that tries to pretend that marriage is just about “love.” Adopted children have the right to parents as much as anybody else. When homosexual couples are legally equated with heterosexuals, children’s needs for parents of both genders cannot be protected by law.

I am a straight woman who has no problem if homosexuals get married. I have no problem with it because I know that the gay couples who do decide to marry love each other. I believe marriage is based upon the love of one another and the promise to be faithful to that person no matter what, and gender plays no part in either faith or love. Gays should have the same marriage rights as a Man and Woman. Marriage is not an action that should be prejudice against how people feel about each other. If a gay couple should decide to be married it would be for the same reasons a man and a woman decide to be married. Many say it is against the word of God that a man should ever be married to a man or a woman to a woman, but the word of God should not be forced upon people; though Christianity is a popular belief in the U.S. America has the law “separation between church and state”. Many historical figures that we know and look up to were gay. Historical men like Oscar Wilde, Socrates, Andy Warhol, Julius Caesar, and Alexander the Great just to name a few of many were all homosexual. Other countries, besides a few states in the U.S., allow same-sex marriage such as Canada, Belgium, The Netherlands, Spain, and South Africa. If a person loves another and they wish to be bonded by marriage then why should they be denied that happiness, because of their gender? If it makes others uncomfortable then turn your head but do not shame someone into thinking they are wrong for loving someone. If straight people cannot find a just reason to deny homosexual marriages then it should not be denied.

I am straight and I do not have any problem with gay marriage only if is not made under the name of God or in a church. I believe gay people have the right to have legal rights as any other straight couple. But they would also have to respect God’s and other people’s religions.
It would make sense for the society to accept that gay couples need a license to allow them to have the rights to share everything as a married couple since there are gay couples who live together as they were married. Also, gay people are humans therefore they have the same rights as any other person.

I would like to know which amendment states that marriage is a right…we hear about the right to vote, to bear arms etc, where is it stated: the right to marriage..gay or otherwise?

I can’t believe how ignorant this country has become. Yes God loves everyone, but that doesn’t mean he likes what we do. His word does not change or bend for anyone. Yes marriage is HOLY matramony and it’s funny to me how we as people want to be supported in our mess and filthy lifestyles. Just because it feels good or doesn’t directly effect other people doesn’t make it right and it does go against the sactity of marriage.I know alot of gay people and I tell them just the same I like you as the person, but I don’t agree nor will I condone what you do…I also have had those feelings to be with the same sex however I’ll never do it because even though think it may make me feel good I know it isn’t right so I don’t act accordingly…

It’s also important to know where it came from..Satan thought he could stop Christ from being born if he could create unnatural affection (and it clearly calls it UNNATURAL AFFECTION) between the same sex, however he didn’t realize Christ didn’t need to get here through sexual intimacy..Also God showed us how he felt about it when he destroyed Sodom and Gomora..

I find it crazy that a country that was built on the principle of Christianity has become so dumb founded and lost. I find it funny that now we as Christians are being mocked for our beliefs, yet we make alters for muslims in public and other religions, but as soon as Jesus is mentioned everyone wants to riot….That’s saying spmething within itself if you think about it..why does everyone get so angry to hear his name? Maybe because as much as some don’t want to admit Jesus is real.

What anti-gay marriage proponents seem to be overlooking is that not all CHURCHES oppose gay marriage. My wife and I were married in a FULL CATHOLIC CEREMONY (MASS), in OUR CHURCH, last November, in Florida. During the ceremony, our priest said that although the State of Florida refuses to recognize our marriage, our church DOES recognize our marriage. My wife and I feel that not only are our CIVIL RIGHTS violated EVERY DAY through a lack of recognized validity of our relationship by the State of Florida, but also, our RELIGIOUS RIGHTS are being validated because the State of Florida says that what OUR CHURCH recognizes, the State will not…..
Our church, the Ecumenical Catholic Communion, performs marriages for gay and straight couples with no distinction. Other churches such as the United Church of Christ and Metropolitan Community Churches do the same…. Those same-sex couple who were married by their churches need to band together and point out to our opponents that not only are they make a mockery of our relationships and deem them to be “second class,” they are also, by default, saying that our churches are second class as well. To those of you who disapprove of gay marriage based on “religious” premise, our question is this: “Are we really going to get into tennis match of ‘our church is better than yours’???” And to those of you who believe that they are against gay marriage, we say this: IF YOU DON’T BElIEVE or LIKE GAY MARRIAGE, PLEASE/PLEASE/PLEASE…. …. DO NOT MARRY A GAY PERSON!!! LEAVE THAT TO THOSE OF US WHO, WITHOUT A DOUBT, AND BY FAITH, TRULY BELIEVE THAT GOD GAVE US A BLESSED GIFT IN THAT OF OUR SPOUSES — IT’S JUST THAT THE GIFT CAME IN A SAME SEX, RATHER THAN OPPOSITE SEX, PACKAGE. HOW DARE WE TELL GOD THAT WHAT HE GAVE US IS “WRONG”!!!!!!!

I marched in an anti-prop 8 rally today, not because I’m guy but because I’m an American. As an American it is my right to protest and as a gay american it should be my right to marry whomever I want. I am no less an american that a streight man and I find it absolutely appauling that any government would allow legislation to pass that would make me discriminate against me. I am an American too! Regardless of how anyone feels about gay marriage it is not your right to decide who I can marry. That is my personal decision. And for those the invoke the bible – if it is in fact a sin it is only God that can judge me… YOU ARE NOT GOD and neither is the state or federal government.

Is marriage based on and defined by religion? Tradition? Legality? Cultural identification?
All of the above?
Probably these and others I haven’t thought of but what is needed for a happy, healthy and successful marriage is love, trust, respect, commitment and communication. I cannot see nor understand how people who are against same sex marriage appear to think that only heterosexuals have a monopoly on these aspects of a person. If two people love, respect, etc. each other then they have a right to marry. Those of you who wish to exclude this right to people who are of the same sex are not respectful of the concept of tolerance. We’ve had homosexuality in our culture since the days of the Roman empire and before! Back then it was accepted. Have those of you who limit the right to marry only to those who are “deserving” i.e. opposite sex, de-evolved? I have not, to this day (November 15, 2008) seen nor heard any concrete justification for this prejudicial attitude! Outlawing it will not change the reality of homosexuality. If you are homosexual or not is that person’s concern. Live and let live!
Peace and love to all…
(maybe if we had more of these two concepts we wouldn’t have the desire to run other peoples love lives)

well, where does it stop??? what will keep those sickos from deciding that they should be able to marry their dogs, or cats or mules for that matter??? Our children should not have to be indoctrinated in public school to this crap…these freaks or just pushing America into the arms of Islam and Sharia law…Jehova God help us!!!

Clay, i’m almost reluctant to respond to your ignorant and illogical statements. You make the same argument that racist people made regarding the integration of black americans. And I don’t understand how gay marriage will lead our country to theocracy. People like you should not even comment on the matter. Go get a GED.

SAME SEX MARRIAGE….WHO SHOULD DECIDE?

There is a facet of the debate regarding same sex marriage that I have not yet heard discussed and I would be interested in understanding the perspective of it’s supporters.

It occurs to me that there are two aspects of marriage. First and foremost, it is a universal social institution, it’s definition being defined by society. Second, it is a civil, legal contract.

Most of the legal benefits of marriage have been extended to same sex couples in Civil Union.

Yet, in listening to the supporters of same sex marriage, it seems they desire total equality and total acceptance by society.

This is the point I fail to understand.

How can those that support same sex marriage expect to force and demand the greater majority of society to accept them and change there view point to align with their own when it has twice been made clear that they are unwilling to do so?

Update: In marriage no deity ( God or Gods) is needed to invoke marriage. And no state requires a religious ceremony. And another point marriage is no longer for primarily conception ( as if it ever was). I know my God (Jesus father) doesn’t look at who I Love. You know not to long ago 1967 blacks and whites couldn’t get married it was illegal in some states. Stop bring God into same-sex marriage separation of Church and state. What happened to all men have a right to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness

All I have to say is that if same sex marriage was a normal part of life, we would not be debating the issue….period. Stop lying to yourself and conditioning our youth for acceptance. Those who say “who is it hurting”? Get out of your self centeredness and consider the future of our world. Heck, I feel bad enough for all the children suffering over common divorce. Now we want to impose same sex parenting on the innocent children! Like the Bible says, God will only tolerate so much and when we turn our backs on him, he will abandon us. Better start praying. Don’t forget the part of “the sins of the fathers”. Maybe that is where homosexuality comes into play for those who say “I was born this way.” Ask for forgiveness, have a GENUINE relationship with God ….WHO MADE ADAM AND E V E! Huh, imagine that! and we won’t be having this debate!

Rick Warren is against same sex couples and their marrying because he says it is “unnatural”. A lot of people are born with physiological things that are unnatural for people as a whole but because their unnaturalness does not involve love and attraction for the same sex they can be married. Funny how a bible man can let it slip his mind that what steers his tongue is the book which he believes is god speaking. The christians are using their bible to dictate our lives…hello – wake up.
Marriage is a civil institution. It is a civil right. You are denying people who love one another the happiness they long for and deserve. What gives you the right to tell people who they can or can’t love. Who they can or can not marry? Marriage is a covenant between two people who pledge themselves to each other and then they enjoy the privileges and protections in that union afforded under the law.
Barring same sex marriage is the highest form of bigotry that exists.

1. The social institution under which a man and a woman establish their decision to live as husband and wife by legal commitments, religious ceremonies, etc.
2. A relationship in which two people have pledged themselves to each other in the manner of a husband and wife, without legal sanction: trial marriage; homosexual marriage

If we are to make homosexual marriage legal we will be changing the word marriage which has happened throughout history and culture, but we will also have to change some other words as well…

The term husband in a gay marriage would now refer to the person who is considered the householder.

The term wife would now mean the person who takes on the role of the non householder.

The mother would now be either the non householder or the householder and could be either, or both.

The father could also be either or both.

The child of a gay couple could have two mothers or two fathers unless of course there are several parents which would mean that a child could have three mothers and they could all be male or female.

As far as bride and groom go, either sex could be either bride or groom.

I think we will need a new dictionary to change the meaning of all words.

The meaning of the word marriage has changed, so we will have to change the meaning of many other words that have traditionally been used with the term marriage.

I think gay people should have all the rights of straight couples, but maybe we should create a new word like ‘Garriage’.

I continue to be amazed that “gay marriage” isn’t met with overwhelming laughter from every direction. We humans, even all animals, are equipped with small organs which produce intense, even orgasmic, pleasure when stimulated. Of course nature intended that this lead to procreation, but nature isn’t perfect, so you have instances where couples, even individuals, can produce this pleasure without any chance of reproduction. Why is such a coupling worthy of being recognized by the State as a magical event. The only possible reason for the State to be involved is to assure that its future citizens be reared well.

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News flash for Christians: The New Testament has arrived! It is sad that the same old tired rhetoric is perpetuated by the lower sect christian community. Yes the same community that railed against slave marriage to freed slave marriage to interracial marriage. When will this absurdity end. When will the copies of the New Testament reach the ignorant and the message of love be heard. If you want to base your ethics on a few ambiguous quotes in the Old Testament, fine. However do not invoke the word and name of God. Those of us in the Jewish tradition that actually read Hebrew do not rail with such hate against our brothers and sisters. Love should be based on respect not genitalia.

I do believe in same sex marriages as I am a married woman (yes to a man) and still married and have been for 34 yrs, but have spent the better part of the last 9 years with a woman. And I have seen both sides of this. I know Love is Love and it has no eyes or ears. When you fall in love it is with someone generally of the opposite sex but for those who do happen to fall in love with the same sex or both the love is no different. As I have said Love is Love. If you commit to each other then why not let them be married its not like they will be living with you or taking from you so let the Gay community have there happiness too. You would not want the Gay community to take that away from you now would you?

I am completely for gay marriage and myself being a lesbian can understand the importance of this landmark. However, I have one serious complaint for all gay couples. If we wanted to be taken seriously as people who deserve the same rihts as our straight counter parts than maybe we should act more like adult and be civilized. It is not cute or mature for two men to get married one of which is wearing a vail or dress and women whom one wears biker chaps or a mo hawk. As a community we need to act as one organization and live up to the responsibilites that we want. We need to take pride in each other the same as we do ourselves and partner. If we can not come together and show the world the loving people we are than we will never get equal rights as our counter parts.

Guys there is a great LGBT civil rights organization called the Empowering Spirits Foundation. They are very creative in how they approach this hot topic issue, in that they engage in service oriented activities in communities typically opposed to equal rights to foster thought and change for LGBT equality.

A friend of mine told me about it and I thought it was a great, positive approach to the issue. We had so much fun at the last event and it was great to give back to the community. Plus it was great to converse with others on the other side of the table in a way that wasn’t confrontational.

Anyway, this can be such a heated issue and I thought this was a unique approach.

Guys there is a great LGBT civil rights organization called the Empowering Spirits Foundation. They are very creative in how they approach this hot topic issue of gay marriage, in that they engage in service oriented activities in communities typically opposed to equal rights to foster thought and change for LGBT equality.

A friend of mine told me about it and I thought it was a great, positive approach to the issue. We had so much fun at the last event and it was great to give back to the community. Plus it was great to converse with others on the other side of the table in a way that wasn’t confrontational.

Anyway, this can be such a heated issue and I thought this was a unique approach.

http://www.facebook.com/pages/Empowering-Spirits-Foundation/49288966338

Using “gay” and “marriage” in the same sentence is an oxymoron. Marriage is, in fact, defined as a union between a man and a woman (modern corruptions of that excluded). Title 1, Chapter 1, Section 7 of U.S. Code states: “In determining the meaning of any Act of Congress, or of any ruling, regulation, or interpretation of the various administrative bureaus and agencies of the United States, the word “marriage” means only a legal union between one man and one woman as husband and wife, and the word “spouse” refers only to a person of the opposite sex who is a husband or a wife.” Call it a civil union, or whatever catchy phrase you can come up with, but it is not truly “marriage” under Federal law. So then, what exactly is any state “recognizing”? Such a union isn’t recognized under Federal law, so it cannot be used to file Federal tax returns as a “married” couple, or for recognition of Social Security survivorship rights, for ERISA purposes (e.g., defined benefit / 401(k) plans), or other similar things. You could call me “married” to my job and it has the same net effect…nothing.

Instead of asking society to equalise gay unions and marriage, gays should ask God to equalise them, since no human law can accomplish it. I sincerely feel for the affliction of gays. They report that they are born with the tendency to love people of the same sex, but in gay unions of course they can never share the physical and spiritual blending of souls which happens when a man and a woman make a baby. This shared experience is mysterious and awesome. It is beautiful and magnificent. It is a stone that shines so brightly on the beach that there can be no denying that it is something special. God made the world that way. His goodness is so perfectly obvious. Making babies together creates a bond which is stronger than any legal or religious structure ever could be. Traditional marriage is society’s humble acknowledgement of the value of that bond. Since gays can never share the unique experience of making babies with their partners in gay unions, perhaps it is difficult for them to understand the value of traditional marriage. I am sorry that gays can’t make babies together, as I am sorry for infertile couples, or mentally and emotionally disturbed people who aren’t able to form loving relationships at all. However, I pray that all gays will accept the reality of their effective infertility, yet in the face of such disappointment, show the courage and the generousity of spirit to respect our shared, procreation-dependent humanity, and help us all to honor the glimmering stone of traditional marriage, even if gays are unable to fully experience the majic of making babies with their gay partners.

There seem to be some moral inconsistencies and/or ambiguities about same-sex marriages. With all due respect to those in the gay community as fellow human beings, I nevertheless believe a “union” between two men or women raise some inherently moral questions.

First, would two men or women of the same family be permitted to marry, since there would be no procreation invovled?

Would same-sex marriages allow for polygamy? Why or why not?

Would or could “adultery” be committed in a same-sex marriage? Why would it be “wrong”?

In these above questions, the idea that these traditional relational “wrongs” in heterosexual marriages would necessarily translate into a definition and perameters of same-sex marriages is, at the very least, somewhat confusing. Why or how would these still be “wrong” if the very definition of a man and woman constituting a marriage has been undermined? Why would one retain particular set of moral norms one at the exclusion of the most foundational aspect of marriage?

Marriage, in the same-sex case, seems to be built upon nothing much more than individual desires, rather than something committed to higher, transcendent realities. It appears selfish to some degree.It demonstrates a desire between two people, but little else. The institution in this sense denies procreation. It is apparent, whether one is religious or not, that the physiological aspects of our humanity highly encourage a physical relationship between a man and a woman for the purpose of child rearing.

If the foundational premise of the institution “marriage” between a man and a woman is abolished, what be the reason to keep any of the other definitions or aspects of traditional marriage within a same-sex union?

Ultimately, marriage has a moral component to it. The gay community wishes to have their unions recognized, but yet hold in contempt the religious cultural mores which have given rise to the institution of marriage itself.

Rights are tricky everyone wants them to cover everything, but not all of them are right to have. The entire country might eventually be given the right for same sex marriage, then I’m predicting you will see us loss our country entirely losing all the rights they had as an American. Homosexuals will win their battle but loss the war for the entire nation. I think a lot of people read the Bible and just simply ignore it, a big sign that a nation is soon to fall. Just my opinion

Civil Unions are where Gay bonding should be held. Respect for gay individuals is, and should be established in any loving community, even though the morals are not supported. Civil Unions provide equal rights. If respect and equality are the issue, then why are Gay people fighting for marriage? That is entirely disrespectful as Marriage is a union not made by man, but by God alone. Fighting for marriage is disrespecting faith, religion, and God… in essence, laughing in His face. I see no dignity or respect when trying to disregard and disrespect the definition of marriage. Although many heterosexuals have discraced the sacrament of mariage by divorce and selfish gratifications, this holy covenenant is not any less sacred. Respect goes both ways.

Marriage is a LEGAL contract. If you site religion or God as an argument to outlaw gay marriage then you are not following the separation of church and state that this country was founded on. God CAN NOT be used as an argument against gay marriage without going AGAIST the constitution! Period! That is what it means to be an American.

I consider myself a fairly liberal person. You have your beliefs I have mine. Allowing same sex marriage is well…….not right, to put it lightly. Marriage is an institution that is not to be taken as lightly as some people would like to. Aside from the religious arguments against it, since I am an agnostic atheist. Tradition is tradition, the couple of man and woman should not be broken. Even a lesbian couple needs a man to produce the offspring in one way or another and that is the way I see marriage. A way to procreate and provide a stable environment for the child to grow up in. Of course some lesbians and gays may raise children(and if you have have problems with me putting you in classes of lesbians and gays well you do know where [edited]) but I d not want 2 fathers or 2 mothers. I fell every child has the same right to a mother and a father.

I am an agnostic athiest so your god debate is out the window. I just do not think it is right to break a tradition that my ancestors have fought so hard to maintain. You and another woman or if you are a tv can never produce offspring without the opposite sex. Put science aside my ancestors fought to keep the relationship with between man and woman to produce children sacred. Even dying at times for not sharing the newly wedded wife.

I donot understand what people are thinking. Obey the laws of the land, except it tells you to offend the laws of god. How can we be foolish enough to say that everyone has the same right to be married. Marriage is for a man and a woman. Not two men, not two women. This country is going to crap. This country is one of the most immoral countries on the face of the earth. If passed thats mans law. How can we put our trust in a man. You can be married by a judge, he will say to you what god has put together,let no MAN put asunder. That same man will turn around and grant you a divorce.Come on people is that not the sane thing that happened with sodom and gomorrah? God will pour out his wrath on this people. The book of timothy tells us these thimgs will happen. For men will be lovers of themselves (selfish). Lovers of pleasure more than lovers of God. Wise up people, When all of mans laws have let you down. God is the last one we all have to face.

Until recently I opposed gay marriage. After researching natural law I have to change my opinion. Natural law say everyone has a right to be free,and laws that are created should only be to defend our natural right to be free. Gay marriage has no barring on my natural right to be free.

It seems that the only real reason to oppose same-sex marriage is……nothing. There isn’t one.
Being religious is becoming more and more unfashionable, and the people coming up with bible references time and time again are behaving like spoilt little brats in their desperation. Throw as many toys out of your prams as you want, but your “love for” (fear of) God will not save christianity from eventually dying out and gays will eventually not only be given the right to declare their love for one another, but gay children will be respected in schools and grow happy and healthy along with the rest of western society.

Hang in there.

I decided to find such a forum to express my feelings about what marriage was meant to be. I do not intend to offend anyone but I find that particularly when the AIDs epidemicc originally broke out, there were also revelations about the practices of male (particularly) homosexuals, you know the casual, anonymous sex in bath houses, parks, bathrooms,etc. Very lewd and premiscuous behavior.

It seems that then the idea of fidelity and less risky behavior was supposed to become the ‘norm’ for gays and since this revelation and new face of the gay male was addressed, the idea of marriage between same sex couples became far more prevelent. Of course, folks are going to argue God’s word, they’re even going to compare their sexual struggle with the Black race struggle. The last I heard, being born Black or any other color was not a sin.

I just do not understand how same sex people feel that it is okay to marry. Is it because you think that you can legitimize the behavior? Do you think that you can change the word of God. Seriously. God did say, “Go forth and multiply” so the meaning of marriage is for a man and woman to procreate. The same sex can bear children from donors or willing ‘other parties’ but together they cannot have children. Again, I am not bashing anyone but the concept of marriage between same sex just seems wrong to me and makes me feel that some Gays will go to any extent to think of legitimizing fornication, which is what sex outside of marriage is. Look it up.

I dislike when people say ’some of my best frienda are….’ but I have had gay male friends and I have worked with gay females. What I have found is that I can have a good conversation with them to a point. I seem to stay away from the relationship subject because one gay male wanted to show me pictures of himself in drag.The gay males have dislike for many females and the females had a definite dislike for males. I mean whenever I engaged in coversation with a gay female she was bashing what ’straight’ couples did and how stupid women were for falling for men. I never bashed gay folk but I felt that the gay person had to try over and over and over to justify (without saying) why they were gay. It just seems too, that there are too many variants in the gay world, the masculine, the effeminate, the butch, transgendered, the cross dressers,. I cannot quite relate and I am not sorry for this but I just want to learn to respect it. Now, get me right, when I see past a person’s sexual identity I find a human there just as I do anyone else but I cannot in honesty understand
it to this day and I think it’s because Gays would prefer that everyone should be gay and where would that put the world. It’s just a thought, not a bash. Humans would just die out. Thank you

It’s all very simple… those who choose an immoral lifestyle, one with which most Americans disagree, are at liberty to marry someone of the opposite sex, just like everyone else. A gay man may marry a woman just as a lesbian may marry a man. They have the same rights as everyone else! There IS no discrimination on this issue, and it does not fall under a Civil Rights argument. Who they choose to do “whatever” with, is up to them.

Here is my take on same sex marriage. If you love someone you love them. If you want to be with them forever and marry them thats your own personal choice. This is a freedom of choice coutry. Those who oppose same sex marriages are not typically the ones wanting to marry someone of the same sex as themselves. So in conclusion we can say that if same sex marriages do not directly apply to you as a gay American, why should you have anything to say about it! Its not like there are a bunch of gay protesters out there trying to eliminate the option for a man to marry a woman. They are just wanting the freedom to marry who they choose to love. Again, if it does not directly affect you, why should you be allowed to have a say on it!

yeah that’s cool

As a pscyh student and being gay – myself – repressed on a diurnal basis; good-looking; a man of all seasons, open-minded; why can’t we just all get along? The traditional view of ‘marriage’ is so underrated. How many failed ‘heterosexual’ marriages? C’mon guys and gals, give us the opportunity to be ourselves – regardless of labels and stereotypes! We’re not here to surpass anything just make a point: WE ARE ALL THE SAME!

And in the begining God made them man & woman, that which goes against the natural order, the order of nature, which our country is based upon, can never be called right.

animals, do not have same sex partners. Every one should have the right to their, pensions insurance and so forth, however when you make a choice that is against the natural order, or law, God’s or Man’s you have to accept the outcome, of that choice. By making the choice to be unnatural, you have chosen the conditions for doing so.

God Bless all God’s People,
Give them wisdom, Give them Light.

It was said at one time that picture a man with a woman’s brain and vice versa? What happens when a man has a brain of a child and loves a child too much where it becomes sexual? Let’s look at the Bible some may not agree with every thing it may say but as a whole it is all good and loving to build our lives around..Morals,standards harmony piece…..I have met both gay and lesbians and some to be very bizarre with accents and the knowing slang of flaming behavior but in all have found them normal beyond their sexuality. I for one have nothing against gays nor lesbians but do not believe in same sex marriages. It is a biblical act we go against, other things I believe will follow. More wars, laws will change where you don’t have to place you hand on the bible before testifying in a court of law( Why we don’t even go by it anymore) Just because we may have adapted that homosexuality does exist doesn’t make it acceptable. They may try to find all loop holes there may be but there are consequences for such a dramatic change it’s almost absurd but how do I know what’s right and whats wrong anymore the foundation of my life and 70 percent of other Americans who are against same sex marriages have already been casted out of schools and possibly soon our court of law. Because of different religions we’ve had to adapt probably due to immigration… consequence? Our poor economy..I have so many mixed emotions on this that it may seem like a brain storm… sorry just NO! on same sex marriages

I’m confused about same-sex marriage. I was raised in a Christian environment all my life, though I must admit my family has never been regular “church-going” people. Regardless, I say my prayers every night and wear a cross around my neck to remember our Savior Jesus Christ. It comforts me. But when I am confronted with an uncomfortable situation that I do not fully understand, and would rather not “talk shop” with people of my own age, I always look to God. Ever since I was young, I had been taught that homosexuality is very wrong. Being straight, I naturally didn’t take these comments very seriously. That is, until a young man named Matthew Sheppard was killed just minutes from my house. He had been beaten and tied to a fencepost for being gay. Shortly after, my family and I moved to a different town. My mother and father never mentioned the incident again, but I do remember my Dad quoting the bible on one occasion, in which he read:

“For this reason God gave them up to vile passions. For even their women exchanged the natural use for what is against nature. Likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust for one another, men with men committing what is shameful, and receiving in themselves the penalty of their error which was due.”
—Romans 1:26-27

“Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived. Neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor homosexuals, nor sodomites, nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners will inherit the kingdom of God.”
—1 Corinthians 6:9-10

I have questioned God only a handful of times, just as every religious person has, regardless of what they tell you. But I do believe that the bible is Holy. And the text written in it, is the truth. Honestly, I’ve felt uncomfortable around gay individuals, as I’m sure they have felt around me. As a reckless and irresponsible teenage, I’m aware that my opinion is not held in the highest esteem. But I cannot support gay marriage because of my religious and personal beliefs. As I’m sure is the case for countless kids around the world… sitting on their computers, just wishing that being “neutral” was an actual possibility on the issue.